Le mercredi 28 décembre à 16:59, Michael Prokop a écrit :

• Philippe Delavalade [Wed Dec 28, 2011 at 04:42:58PM +0100]:

...

I have already complain about the removal of the brltty boot option in the new release.

If someone is stepping up to help us maintaining that we can bring it back.

I fear that I can't do this ; I'm just an enduser...

...

Now, I realise that the new grml is nomore suitable as host system to build linuxfromscratch ; previously I recommanded it as livecd for this purpous but now, important packages are missing...

Which packages exactly are missing?

For instance : bison, m4, texinfo, etc.

Do you have any documentation what you exactly did on Grml when building LFS?

I'd never built lfs with grml but with debian testing ; but many people ask about a livecd as host system to do this. I have just verified the host system requirements :

http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/lfs/view/stable/prologue/hostreqs.html

Regards.

* Philippe Delavalade wrote [29.12.11 13:17]:

...

...

Now, I realise that the new grml is nomore suitable as host system to build linuxfromscratch ; previously I recommanded it as livecd for this purpous but now, important packages are missing...

Which packages exactly are missing?

For instance : bison, m4, texinfo, etc.

You must download the sources for your LFS system anyway. So typically you have a working network connection and can install the packages anyway. If we have snapshot.d.o URIs in the sources.list you can do that without updating your whole system. So i don't see any reason to ship these packages.

Philippe,

In addition to the option of remastering Grml with the tools you need, it can also be used as a "persistent" live system, with the modifications to the live filesystem saved to a partition or snapshot file, e.g. on a usb drive.  This is what I would probably do to save my work over a days-long project such as building LFS; in fact, I have used Grml persistent systems for weeks or months.

Hope this helps.

On Dec 29, 2011 12:13 PM, Philippe Delavalade <philippe.delavalade@sfr.fr> wrote:

Le jeudi 29 décembre à 14:21, Ulrich Dangel a écrit :

> * Philippe Delavalade wrote [29.12.11 13:17]:

> > > > Now, I realise that the new grml is nomore suitable as host system to build

> > > > linuxfromscratch ; previously I recommanded it as livecd for this purpous

> > > > but now, important packages are missing...

> > >

> > > Which packages exactly are missing?

> >

> > For instance : bison, m4, texinfo, etc.

>

> You must download the sources for your LFS system anyway. So typically

> you have a working network connection and can install the packages

> anyway. If we have snapshot.d.o URIs in the sources.list you can do that

> without updating your whole system. So i don't see any reason to ship

> these packages.

Yes but sources can be download with any system (not necessarly a linux

one) ; the most important is that the lfs build is long and often people

stop and restart later ; so, they'll have to update each time the missang

packages. And, one time, I have built on a computer with no network but it

was a long time ago and the lfs livecd was uptodate ; now, there's nomore

specific lfs livecd...

From: "Philippe Delavalade" philippe.delavalade@sfr.fr To: grml@ml.grml.org

I don't agree :-) For me, it is simpler to use grml2iso one time :

grml2iso -b "my boot options" -o grml_brl.iso grml_2011.05.iso

and then, there's nothing to do !

Well, you are free to disagree, of course. But you should explain why you disagree. What is easier about doing things the old way? The way it works now is you wait for the tone, press q, and type 'brltty'. There is less to type and you don't have to worry about timing. How is the old way easier?

Le jeudi 29 décembre à 15:22, John G. Heim a écrit :

From: "Philippe Delavalade" philippe.delavalade@sfr.fr To: grml@ml.grml.org

...

I don't agree :-) For me, it is simpler to use grml2iso one time :

grml2iso -b "my boot options" -o grml_brl.iso grml_2011.05.iso

and then, there's nothing to do !

Well, you are free to disagree, of course. But you should explain why you disagree. What is easier about doing things the old way? The way it works now is you wait for the tone, press q, and type 'brltty'. There is less to type and you don't have to worry about timing. How is the old way easier?

Maybe my english is too bad :-)

I type one grml2iso command ; I burn a CD and then, on aech boot, I have exactly nothing to do.

Le jeudi 29 décembre à 20:18, Ulrich Dangel a écrit :

• Philippe Delavalade wrote [29.12.11 14:25]:

Hi Philippe ,

HI Ulrich.

JFTR we are currently discussing our decision regarding the brltty boot option. We just discovered that the bootoption was for example already according to http://mielke.cc/brltty/guidelines.html Christan Hofstaedtler reported http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=653587 while investigating the current state of brltty in Debian.

I have no information about this ; I'll try to follow these links next week.

One small question does brltty really supports configuring itself via the bootoption?

Yes, perfectly for me with grml or debian.

Do you need any parameters like -b -d or -t at all if you specify the brltty boot option in the commandline?

I don't understand exactly what you mean ; nevertheless, I'll try to answer as best as possible :

1) with the correct boot option (for me brltty=pm,usb:,fr_FR), there's nothing more to do ; 2) without the boot option, after the tones in grml_2011.12, without any boot option about language, I have to use the -t option on the commandline ; but for someone connected with something else than usb, the -b and -d options are mandatory.

I hope this is the answer you are waiting for :-)

...

I don't agree :-) For me, it is simpler to use grml2iso one time :

grml2iso -b "my boot options" -o grml_brl.iso grml_2011.05.iso

and then, there's nothing to do !

JFTR you can still do it:

1. Create a directory named /tmp/grml_overlay We will use grml2iso to

copy the content of this directory to the iso. 2) Create a directory named scripts inside /tmp/grml_overlay and create a script named grml.sh inside the directory (/tmp/grml_overlay/scripts/grml.sh) 3) Inside the script run the necessary commands to start brltty

Shall I se the bootoption style or the commandline style ? I guess the command line but...

4. run

grml2iso -b "boot options scripts" -c /tmp/grml_overlay -o grml_brl.iso grml_2011.05.iso

I think you mean grml_2011.12.iso or is it a mistake from me ?

And in the -b parameter, shall I, for instance, type : "lang=fr scripts" ?

The important option here is the scripts bootoption which will automatically run scripts/grml.sh at startup. This allows you to automatically start brltty on your own. The -c bootoption copies the content from the specified directory directly onto the iso image containing your script which will start brltty.

This is perfect for me but I fear it's a little complicated for other blind people I know :-)

OVERLAY_DIR=/tmp/grml_overlay mkdir "$OVERLAY_DIR" mkdir "$OVERLAY_DIR"/scripts vi "$OVERLAY_DIR"/scripts/grml.sh

I should have used {$OVERLAY_DIR} or simply $OVERLAY_dir ; am I wrong ?

chmod 755 $OVERLAY_DIR"/scripts/grml.sh grml2iso -b "boot options scripts" -c /tmp/grml_overlay -o grml_brl.iso grml_2011.05.iso

I'll try this as soon as possible but not this new year week-end.

cheers,

Real thanks !