* Mark 27e3kk302@sneakemail.com [20060905 01:15]:
problems start with multiple devices or devices with several partitions on it
Or moving the USB device from PC to PC. That is the whole point of using USB for many people. When you move the device, however, /dev/sda becomes /dev/sdd so the old-style fstab syntax just breaks.
ACK.
Mika is probably right about automount. His opinions are what make grml so great.
On the other hand, *nix is a 30-year-old design. Not all of it is still 100% right for today. The fstab topic deserves more comments. I have opinions about fstab.
The /dev/XYZ syntax does not help. I much prefer labels/UUIDs. They are *much* less brittle for OS design. It makes more sense to use labels/UUIDs than to synchronize /dev/XYZ changes. A system based on labels/UUIDs has nothing to sync. It "just works."
It fails as soon as multiple devices have the same fs-label.
[...]
The traditional /dev/XYZ syntax is just a sysadmin preference. It should not be turned into a fixed rule. The rule being cemented now is this: "grml will always use /dev/XYZ syntax no matter what you want, but we offer some alternative /dev/ABC-XYZ syntax too."
The way to handle syadmin preferences is cheatcodes. A grml cheatcode already toggles "build fstab." A new cheatcode could toggle "use labels when building fstab" and "use UUIDs when building fstab." That way, old-school sysadmins could keep /dev/XYZ (and risk the brittleness).
People don't read the docs (ask my mailbox). I want to avoid the use of bootoptions as far as possible.
Duplicate label problems are solved by UUIDs. People worried about that should use UUIDs. Incidentally, blkid gives the UUID.
Yes, but UUIDs are long and IMO they suck a little bit on non-server-systems.
Additionally we will create /dev/usb-sd* devices via udev rules like:
The philosophy of grml was to avoid "symlink hell." I'm ok with any solution that is not better handled by fstab labels.
"symlink hell" in regards to "init-stuff which has to be handled manually" (/etc/rc*.d). You don't have to take care of /dev/usb-sd* at all. All symlinks will be deleted automatically as soon as the devices aren't present anymore. Nothing to care about.
If the entire purpose is to avoid labels, then I do not like the solution, because syntax is a poor reason to do anything. Besides, you could still put /dev/XYZ in comment sections of the fstab file.
Swap partitions are even worse. There is no fine control. I'm not sure how to handle them automatically in any Debian system very well. It's all-or-nothing. Grml activates all swap partitions without regard to fstab unless you boot with cheatcode "noswap" which turns them *all* off.
You can do swapon by label. You can also boot noswap. So then, by hand, you have full control: boot noswap and do swapon by label, one swap at a time. This technique gives you full control over which partitions are used.
Yes.
Some of us like automation. Some of us *need* automation for end users. It would be nice to have labels for this purpose in fstab. So, in effect, the rule might be this: "only use a swap patition with these UUIDs and no other swaps you detect."
Usually you set up a swap partition because you want to *use* it. :) If you set up several swap partitions and want to use only a specific one I think you have to handle this in your own initscript.
These are my inputs: Consider the mobile USB case. Think about putting /dev/XYZ in fstab comments (where they are still visible, but not active).
Ok.
Avoid symlink hell.
As written above: don't care about stuff you don't have to manage on your own. :)
Think about using cheatcodes to implement sysadmin prefs.
I'll talk about it with the other grmldevs on the next develmeeting.
regards, -mika-